Chinos, loafers and a sports jacket (or sweater)
Those on the Drake’s mailing list may have seen this outfit on Friday, accompanying an article on their new trouser range.
To fill in the details: the olive Drake’s chinos were worn with a white lightweight pique-cotton shirt made by Luca Avitabile, Belgravia tassel slip-ons from Edward Green in dark oak, and two options on top.
The first was my oatmeal-cashmere jacket from Elia Caliendo (in Loro Piana jacketing), which as we know from the original post on it, is rather nice with green trousers.
The second option, pictured further down, is a knitwear stand-by - the short shawl-collar model from Anderson & Sheppard, in navy.
The pique on the shirt is lovely in the summer but a touch transparent, so I wouldn’t necessarily recommend it. Fine for off-duty, but not safe for work.
As with our Friday Polos, however, I do like the casual effect achieved by chopping off the shirt’s placket and buttons half way.
The navy shawl-collar is particularly nice with the Drake’s trousers, as they are rather high-waisted. They are also quite slim on the thigh: I sized up (to a 34") and had the waist taken in.
As the Drake’s article explains, the colour and cloth choice in the new range is extremely versatile: mid-grey flannel, dark-grey worsted, olive chino and stone chino. For a capsule collection to go with odd jackets, it’s hard to think of a better selection.
The quality's also good, being made by Rota, with nice corozo buttons - and they're good value at £225.
If I had my way they would side tabs rather than belt loops and be a little lower in the rise, but you can’t have everything.
The belt is my bespoke alligator one with a brass buckle. Apologies for lack of article on that - I realise it's been a while.
Tabs would be nice. I think the rise looks fine though, it’s not too high that you would feel odd when taking off the jacket. For RTW, I myself have a harder time of finding a good mid-to-high rise
True, it wouldn’t look odd. And they are hard to find
I think the rise is just about perfect on the trousers, Simon.
The only jarring point for me is the loafers. I’ll admit that I’m not a huge fan of tassels but the extremely dark colour looks too formal with chinos to my eyes. I think snuff suede would be a better fit, or ideally, the ‘polo’ suede that Carmina and C&J – the reddish tinge would play beautifully against the muted olive green of the chinos. All in theory of course. Might be a bit flashy in practice.
http://cdn.styleforum.net/e/e1/e1d37711_IMG_4474.jpeg
Yes, polo suede would have been nice.
I like the dark brown for a touch more formality, and I think it works with a white shirt too, but polo would have been a good, slightly more casual option.
James,
I love loafers in general, and tassel loafers in particular, especially when paired with a less formal trouser. Not denim, mind you, but a tailored chino for sure. I think they can elevate a casual ensemble to something between casual and business casual.
Agree about the rise. I’m having all my pants made now with a higher rise and slimmer through the upper thigh — love the drape so much more than the typical RTW article.
Hi Simon,
I remember reading in a past post that your navy A&S cardigan pictured is a medium. I like the cardigan very much and was just a little concerned before purchase re the sizing. I’m a 43-44′ chest and would usually wear a large in most tops. On the A& S site this would put me as a medium the same that you have.
Do you find the cardigan to be quite fitting or loose? Im not a huge fan of the skinny/slim fit around the chest and arms. Thanks for your time.
Hey. I’d go for a large in that case – I wear a medium and I’m a 39 chest
Simon, I’m struggling to understand the price point, which seems to be around that of some made to measure tailors, particularly outside of London. Why not have a pair of chinos made-2-measure with side tabs, and without the hassle and additional cost of a waist adjustment to cope with a slim thigh? What am I missing?
Rota is a very high level of make – the same as Anderson & Sheppard, for example, which are £350. You won’t get this level or materials with the vast majority of MTM makers.
Have to agree with James on the shoes; way off really.
Chinos will never get anywhere near to formal, so it makes no sense to wear formal shoes, even if they are near the informal end of formal.
The best way to go with chinos or linen trousers is to match them with Italian moccasins,Belgian loafers or crepe soled desert boots.
Hi Simon,
This is a very sharp outfit! You’ve been right about the elegance of this muted oatmeal jacket. Now since I’m not a tassel loafers wearer, if I had been in your shoes, so to speak, I would have kept all the other items in place and then pick up your AS suede single monk strap. But in no way would I have followedJame’s advice by choosing the polo suede. Why? Because it would have drawn too much attention to the feet, whereas the obvious big challenge with such an outfit is to remain within the constraints of colors while maintaining a certain level of sophistication, which … this specific kind of monk strap easily meets too. For sure, as to shoes there are other options too.
By the way, I’ve found your piece posted on Drake’s website very interesting. I completely agree with you about the versality of stone chinos. But as you also mentionned, it’s not always easy to find the right shade.
John
I have the dark-grey worsted which come with side adjusters and a nice extended waistband – very nice they are too. Drake’s getting a lot right at the moment.
Hi Simon,
How would you compare these, make and style-wise, with the trousers from Incotex?
Thanks,
Jonathan
Different style – in height and most importantly wash. Incotex’s washed chinos feel more like the chino you’re used to. The drakes ones are not washed and so have a cleaner, sharper line and are more formal
It’s a shame that Drakes don’t offer longer sizings for their trousers and jackets. All of their trousers for this season come with a 33″ leg as standard, which is way too short for me. I can understand why a smaller retailer would be unwilling to offer trousers finished to different lengths, but why not just sell them unhemmed?
Worth double checking that – mine were unhemmed and I think the full range is. They offer finishing and alterations on length
I love the one-button cuffs on the jacket – very nice.
It’s a traditional Neapolitan touch
Hello Simon, the chinos look good, but I was wondering if the 2% elastan have any advantage for pants that are not tight.
They will always be more comfortable, given they stretch around the seat and knees, and won’t become misshapen in those areas as a result either. But they won’t have the character of 100% cotton in terms of how they wear and wrinkle either.
Simon, do you have a general rule of thumb when you prefer belt loops over side tabs? I usually consider chino a relatively casual fabric and would figure belt loops here? And while we are on the subject – do you have any feelings one way or another on d-ring side tabs vs a regular square buckle?
I generally don’t wear belts – it’s pretty much side tabs with everything. But chinos are the one thing I would wear a belt with sometimes. (Jeans always with unused belt loops).
A square buckle is usually neater and smarter. D-rings (indeed, O-rings) can be nice on more casual trousers.
When adding side adjusterd to a pair of RTW trousers, do they need to have an extended tab waistband?
No
Hello Simon, why no belt with jeans?
Also, what do you think of the more fashion-forward look of rolled up slim chinos? And which brands or manufacturers would you recommend for slightly more casual chinos (think without the crease) than the ones from Drakes or Incotex?
Thanks.
I generally dislike belts with jeans – it’s personal, but I find belts too chunky and rarely stylish.
I don’t think rolled-up, very slim chinos are that elegant – they look like a trend, and perhaps trying a little too hard.
For more casual chinos, try workwear brands like the real McCoys or places like Clutch Cafe, or Brycelands and The Armoury ‘Army’ chinos
Thanks, Simon. Of course it’s very personal, but why not wear the kind of belt you’d wear with chinos? Do you think there’s a mismatch between a more dressed-up belt and denim (in which case there are some nice canvas belts too)?
It’s not being a dressed-up belt, no. I have vintage belts and canvas belts and webbing belts that work well there.
I just like the aesthetic of jeans without a belt. I think it’s cleaner and yet more rugged too. I also find belts can easily look a little old-mannish.
Hi Simon as Luca Faloni hasn’t had a post yet thought I’d ask on your latest post. Do you have any experience of his items? They look great for summer.
Yes I was waiting for that until he had more stock in for winter. His stuff is very good – and great value. Particularly the slim-cut knitwear and the linen scarves
I’d also be interested in a post on Luca Faloni. The style of the linen shirts and polos look great, as does the price point. Would be beneficial to know more about the brand.
That’s a lovely colour & texture on the jacket – I am not used to seeing chinos with turn-ups, is this common now, am I out of touch? Also I think that the black (or black-looking) socks contribute to a more formal look.
It’s certainly not common, no, but in keeping with the Italian look of turn-ups on odd trousers.
The socks are a dark grey, to continue to line of the trouser and leg – but I agree, do make it more formal too.
Would you mind sharing the measurement of the turn-ups?
Just under 5cm. I normally have 5cm but there wasn’t quite enough here with the inlay in the trouser
About your alteration – I do have the same problem if I buy trousers (RTW) to fit my waist 28″ – they are quite slim on my thighs. Do You think I could buy size 30″ and have the waist taken in? (without ruining the trousers)!
Yep, absolutely. I’ve done it on a few things, including Incotex.
There can be an issue with colour on garment-washed trousers when taking out the waist, but not taking them in.
There can be an issue on taking them with belt loops, which become too close together. But you can just take one off in that case, and centre the other one.
Was going to ask Drakes but may as well ask here….
Being colourblind this may just be a dumb question….
I got the email the other day and went to their site and noted there is no trousers called “stone” but there is a pair labeled as “kharki” which look similar, to my defective eyes, to other company’s “stone” offering. Is it just that they sold out of the stone or have they renamed the colour? Either way not the greatest timing to post an editorial when you are out of stock of the item or have renamed it
Renamed
Simon, do you know if the current (March 2017) set of Drake’s chinos bear any resemblance to the ones in this post, in terms of their cut? Different fabrics, too. There is a “stone,” which looks Khaki, there is a “Khaki,” which looks Olive Green, and sadly, the lovely muted brownish-greenish one from all the photos is nowhere to be seen.
Hi Dan,
The cut is the same, but with the room in the thighs corrected slightly.
The colours are different to this post because this is the summer range, so the cottons etc are different. I wouldn’t necessarily want to wear the ones I featured here in hot weather.
The chinos sold out in most sizes in about a week! Do the ones Rota made for Drake´s have a specific cut or can you get the same elsewhere?
They will be specific in cut, make and material unfortunately.
What’s going on with Edward Green? Dwindling customer service and now available in independents.
Dear Simon,
You have mentioned in the past of getting hold of Incotex chinos & cords with a slightly wider leg (17″+). Where were you able to get these from? Where can I buy regular (not slim) Incotex chinos & cords?
Thank you
Sami
Classic fit Incotex are available at Trunk Clothiers
I hope You would answer my question?
I have been considering either Drakes worsted trouser or their flannels. Which one is the most versatile? It should be used in a rather casual way with a light grey sports jacket or a navy.
The shoes will be suede.
I have read your article about what to wear to grey trousers, but Drakes writes that their flannel goes with grey, blue and brown jackets, so I am leaning toward them??
happy hollidays
Both would be versatile, maybe the flannel slightly more – but it could only be worn half the year
What are good brands for chinos, other than Incotex and Drake’s?
You’re mostly into more run-of-the-mill high street brands after that – Hackett and so on.
Hi Simon,
I bought a pair of Incotex chinos a few months ago. I’ve put on weight so let them out in the waist. I didn’t know they can’t be let out due to the dye process. They are dyed once the trousers are put together. Now I have a pair of trousers I can’t wear as the let out section is a different colour.
Any advice such as getting them dyed again?
Joel
Oh dear, sorry Joel yes that will happen with garment-dyed and sometimes garment-washed clothing as well.
No, I’m afraid not on dying. Some dry cleaners offer it, but it’s a very risky process.
Hi Simon! I’m in the market for a new pair of loafers and am confused about the pros/cons of lined vs unlined & rubber vs leather soles!
Also, I noticed that Paraboot (dax) are similar price-range to C&J. Is the quality comparable?
Lined shoes generally should last a bit better, but I wouldn’t worry about that unless you will be wearing them quite hard (eg they are your only pair).
Unlined will also often be a bit more comfortable but sometimes don’t keep such a clean shape – but it depends on the rest of the structure of the shoe and what the upper is made of
Leather soles are dressier but it doesn’t make a big difference if it’s thin rubber.
And finally yes, Paraboot is a comparable quality level. Often rather chunkier and more casual though.
Do ask more questions if this hasn’t answered them for you
Hi simon i have a pair of armoury sports chino(their slimmer new ones) and have washed and worn them for about a year now. I have noticed they have continued shrinking with each wash to the extend that the length is now a little too short. E.g there is no stitched in cuff. I fold the pants up to create a cufff. Without folding it up the length is perfect. With the cuff it’s too short by 5cm. I’m wondering if ifs possible to extend the length of trousers and be able to cuff it
If there is only that 5cm to turn up, then no it won’t be possible.
I truly admire these tassels which seem to go well with any color trousers. Well done, sir.
Hi Simon!
What would be your advice on charcoal grey chinos?
Would it be too formal in colour for chinos?
Not necessarily, no, but I would err towards greys that are a little more like a dark olive, for example.
If you’re trying to get chinos in a smarter colour, by going with charcoal, then I would suggest trying cord instead – which does work well in that respect in charcoal
Hi Simon, Is it the same cardigan you are wearing https://shop.anderson-sheppard.co.uk/lambswool-shawl-colar-cardigan-navy ?
Yes
Hi again,
May I ask which size are you wearing?
Do you find yourself wearing the cardigan unbuttoned more than buttoned? It seems to me to work better unbuttoned than a traditional shawl collar cardigan.
Medium, and yes it definitely works better unbuttoned
Hi Simon,
I’m looking to get a pair of chinos similar in color to what you’re wearing here – something that looks like a mix of olive and grey. It seems any time I see a pair of olive chinos, the olive color tends to be very much on the yellow-green side of the spectrum (akin to fatigues).
Do you have any recommendations on smart-ish that are done well in a green, but more on the grey side of green, like what you’re wearing here? (It seems that Drakes no longer carries this color, otherwise I’d just get a pair of those.)
Thank you, Simon, for your tireless work at helping us all dress better. Cheers from the U.S.!
Cheers Andrew!
I can’t say I have though on exactly that shade of Olive. The Anglo Italian ones are pretty close