This is the Donegal Overcoat. Yarn from Donegal, woven in Lancashire and manufactured in Manchester.
As an idea, it had its origins in the observation that I wore my brown raglan coat (shown here) more often than any other last winter.
Despite the shortcomings of that piece (low collar, odd button positioning) it was a lovely material and easy to wear - just thrown over anything, whether smart or casual.
As has happened with both previous collaborations (Bridge Coat and Trench Coat), these thoughts were the spur to start talking to Private White VC about making something even better.
I wanted to keep the cloth. Donegal tweed is so pleasing in the texture it creates, yet subtle. There’s slubbiness in there and colour variation when you look carefully, but it never feels as old-fashioned as a big windowpane.
Genuine Donegal yarn, and weaving it in the UK too, appealed to Private White of course, given their emphasis on local make.
I wanted to change the colour though. Brown is great, but too warm and casual to wear with a suit - so I took inspiration from the charcoal donegal jacket Steven Hitchcock made me last year.
That seemed to have the perfect combination of casual texture yet coolness of tone.
Developing the cloth was pretty straightforward. Harder was the overall design of the coat - in fact, rather harder than I expected.
A raglan coat looks so simple. There are no fiddly bits like belts, box pleats or cuffs. It’s all collar and then long drape of cloth.
But actually I think that increases the emphasis on the few design elements there are. The collar really bothered me, for instance, but I couldn’t figure out why.
After a couple of samples, we figured out it wasn’t the collar itself but where it sat on the body. We needed to lift it up, so it encircled the neck and covered the shirt and tie when buttoned.
This is practical, giving more protection from the wind, but also flattering, as it makes the wearer look taller as well as broader across the shoulders.
Walking the coast of Ireland (in fitting with the Donegal theme) put that to the test.
Buttoning up just the top two buttons (also a style I like) showed how well the new collar design worked. There was no need for the throat latch, though we did test that as well.
If you needed to, it was also possible to tighten the cuff of the coat against the cold. And fasten the vent closed at the back, with a hidden button.
I carried across a couple of favourite design points from the Bridge Coat.
One was the deep gold lining, which goes as well with grey Donegal and it did with the Bridge Coat’s navy. Distinctive, but not showy.
Another was cashmere-lined pockets. Frankly, I’ll never understand people that line pockets with bemberg or similar. It’s so cold. Cotton would be no more expensive, and a good deal warmer.
But the ultimate is cashmere (and on both sides, front and back of the hand). It’s like putting on luxurious gloves every time you put your hands in there.
The buttons were also carried across: the matte, two-hole, dark-brown horn that is used on Savile Row tailoring and (for me) immediately separates this from normal ready-to-wear.
There are also small brown flecks in the Donegal cloth - some dark brown, some light - which go well with the buttons. It’s the key reason the coat works with things like jeans and brown suede I think, as well as tailoring. It softens the look.
The outfits pictured here are intended to demonstrate this versatility.
In the outfit below, the coat is worn over a grey roll neck (also Private White), blue denim and brown-suede boots, with a Permanent Style cream watch cap.
That’s for the weekend walk, chucked on to run out with the dog.
Next, the coat is worn at a local coffee shop, with tailoring.
The jacket is in our brown Escorial Tweed, made by Sartoria Zizolfi; the trousers are green flannel by Pommella; and the shirt is in striped PS Oxford cloth.
With Edward Green loafers, it’s smart but not too smart. A good example of the sports-jacket-and-trousers combination I’ve been banging on about for a long time.
And then it’s worn with a tie, below, just to show how smartly that all comes together.
I doubt many readers will want to add the beret. But just so you know, that seems to work nicely as well.
I’m still experimenting with the beret. It’s so practical, rolling up into the pocket, but it sits on a fine line between distinctive and dandy.
Other product points to mention are that we made the coat a couple of inches longer than most, so it drops just below my knee. But it’s easy to shorten if you want (in fact easier than almost any other coat) and we left 2cm of inlay in there so it can even be lengthened.
Full details on alterations at the bottom of this post.
I also reshaped the throat latch. It’s the only significant, asymmetric design point on a coat like this, and often ignored. Ours follows the line of the collar, with angled ends.
And probably most importantly, the collar has a large crescent-shaped insert at the back, between it and the body of the coat.
You can wear the collar of this coat down, but I would always have it up - and it simply won’t stay up without that insert.
It’s something bespoke overcoats often miss out, because they’re cut like a jacket and not designed to be popped up.
Donegal yarn
Here are some details for those that are interested.
First, the cloth, which is really what makes this coat. The long flowing expanse of it is a celebration of that cloth, its character and its texture.
The origin is 'Donegal Yarns': the last remaining spinner of the product in Donegal, Ireland. The tiny mill has been spinning that distinctive flecked yarn since the nineteenth century, and the Kilcarra tweed we used in our coat deliberately echoes the feeling of the very first incarnations.
The mill also dyes, blends, cards and spins all itself - all in a tiny operation between the heather-topped hills and the Irish coast.
Cloth and make
The yarn was then woven by Mallalieus of Delph, a small family-run mill in the middle of the Pennines that dates back to 1863. It is also one of the few vertically integrated mills left in England.
And conveniently close to Private White VC in Manchester, where the coat was manufactured.
The cloth is 620g, which is good for most of the winter in the UK - but not the kind of thing to buy if you need just one coat to survive the season in Boston.
Ordering
- The Donegal Overcoat costs £745 plus VAT. At the moment it is exclusively available through Permanent Style, on the webshop here.
- We have sizes from Small (Private White 3) up to Extra Large (Private White 6).
- Have a close look at the measurements below if you're unsure of sizing, and if in doubt compare to a coat you already own
- However, I would say the coat is standard size, so I would take your normal size - roughly Small for a 48 chest, Medium for 50 and so on. Unlike the Bridge Coat, it is not slim in fit and there should therefore be no need to size up.
- I am six foot tall and usually wear a size 50-chest jacket. I am wearing a Medium.
- As with all our products, there are free returns should you want to change sizes. Ships from the UK.
Measurements:
|
|
Small/3 | Medium/4 | Large/5 | X-Large/6 |
| Chest | 53cm | 56.5 | 60 | 63.5 |
| Waist | 54.5 | 58 | 61.5 | 65 |
| Bottom hem | 61 | 64.5 | 68 | 71.5 |
| Length | 109 | 110 | 111 | 112 |
| Sleeve | 82 | 83 | 84 | 85 |
| Cuff (width) | 14.1 | 14.5 | 14.9 | 15.3 |
Alterations:
- The coat is cut a little longer than most modern overcoats, as I consider it more practical and flattering
- However, it can easily be shortened by a tailor - a good four inches without interrupting much of the balance
- It can also be lengthened slightly if needed, by around 2cm
- The sleeves can also be lengthened by around 2cm if required
- And they can be shortened. Shortening by 1.5cm would be easy - more than that would require the wrist strap to be moved, but that would not be a big job for a tailor
- The body can also be narrowed, but I wouldn't recommend it, as the style is supposed to be roomy, easy to wear, and flow
Photography: Jamie Ferguson @jkf_man
Morning Simon,
Nice coat!
Size wise, having a bridge coat in Medium (it fits very well on the shoulders and chest) would you suggest the same size considering I won‘t wear that often the coat over a suit ? Or you suggest a size down Vs. the bridge coat?
(I am 165cm…and looking proportions on you I guess I’ll have to alternate the length…)
Thanks and have a lovely rest of the day,
Enry
I’d go for the same size probably Enry, although it also depends (like the Trench Coat) how you like to wear it – the shoulders being raglan will pretty much always fit. So if between sizes, perhaps pick depending on whether you’d like th coat a little looser and drapey or not.
And of course, always check the measurements
Love it. If I’m 6ft size 38-40 chest do I go for a large? And do you do returns if it doesn’t suit me!
That sounds like my size, so no I’d go for a Medium. But do always check the measurements, and compare it to a coat you already have if you can.
And yes, we always do free returns
Could it be worn over suit?
Yes, definitely. Best with slightly more casual suits or combinations, eg without a tie or in a slightly more casual material like flannel. But still goes with pretty much any suit because of the dark charcoal colour
You’re completely right about the length. I find too many coats- especiall raincoats to be too short and the effect and practicality is diminished. As to the beret, I find it looks muted and tasteful.
Simon,
I like this very much, and I agree with your preference for longer coats. I can’t really justify any more outwerwear in my life sadly.
Just with a boring ecommerce hat on, it would be good to have some plain mannequin / full length shots of the coat in the PS shop. I’m all for the nice lifestyle shots, but a complete view of the piece is always useful to get the fill context. Likewise with some detail shots – the lighting and focal effects are aesthetically nice, but can make it hard to parse some of the details.
Thanks Sam, noted
Noticed there are now full length shots in the shop. Thanks!
Yep, just added those
Really nice piece! So last year I was looking for a coat precisely like this one. But then some blogger named Simon convinced me I had to buy their Bridge Coat last year, and well, so much for the overcoat I guess!
Talking about pocket lining, I have a coat with velvet lining and I can say that’s crazy confortable to put your hands in them.
Simon, what stands out most here is, I think, the beret. Notwithstanding your interesting article on your tattoo and the fact that it’s been longer term project, I can’t help but think that it, and this headwear, is in part a result of your leaving an office based job. Spending more time with the more “hipster” end of the menswear spectrum ( ie not having the daily exposure to conservatively – even if sometimes poorly – dressed office workers and lawyers in your previous job) means that your sense of “orientation” is shifting. What used to stand out as understated style now looks boring, whilst a tattoo or a beret is now a more common sight. You lose perspective.
Which is very liberating for you and a fine choice, but I do think it shifts the site away from its roots and makes it less relevant. The ethos used to be “be the best dressed man in the room, but in a way in which most people couldn’t quite say why”. The beret really doesn’t fit in with that ethos.
In short, Ethan Newton’s appearance on these pages used to raise comments (“who is that guy in the Hawaiian shirt? Hardly permanent style!”) to which the, in my view valid, response was “that’s Ethan Newton, he pulls it off and he can” With the bigger beard, the tattoo and now the beret, you’re only a pair of small round sunglasses and – with al due respect – a few more calories away from being a Newton copycat. So Ethan Newton’s style is increasingly permanent style Which shows the extent to which there has been a shift.
Not necessarily a bad thing, but definitely less relevant (to me and, I assume, most) and a difference to be noted in how things change.
I know what you mean J. But I would say I don’t think it’s really a shift. I still dress the vast majority of the time in exactly the way you describe.
Like the top shot of me walking in the harbour – and indeed like all the other shots here apart from that one of the beret.
The things I wear might broaden slightly, but 90% of the looks are still wearable, subtle understated style.
I understand the sensitivity, but I hope you agree those other images all fit within that aesthetic and continue to provide everyday inspiration.
I find the beret surprisingly chic, but I keep failing to understand the functionality of headwear that doesn’t cover ones ears. Perhaps I have sensitive ears, ha!
On the topic of evolving into a hipster I strongly disagree. It’s only natural ones style evolves with time and with context. Life would be pretty boring if we were all just set in our ways after the age of 25.
I have to say that I find these posts the most compelling and the more everyday type clothing that is featured on this site feels the most relevant to me personally. I generally skip any article orientated towards office or corporate wear. Dressing for work has never really been something that interests me. It is the life outside of the professional world that is more compelling. More of the smart and considered everyday clothes and tailoring, less on how to keep an Accountant/ Lawyer looking less dull from Monday to Friday.
P.S I’m into the Beret.
Simon, I think you pulled the beret off quite nicely in that shot. Personally, I think it’s nice to see a wider range of looks with tailoring.
May I ask where is the beret from, and what’s your experience with it regarding its functionality as well as its versatility?
Cheers.
Thanks.
It was from Anatomica in Japan (also in Paris). It is a traditional wool basque beret, labelled ‘veritable basque’ rather attractively. But I don’t think that’s a separate brand from what I can see. I’m told Laulhere are pretty good
Thanks Simon.
I can’t quite tell if the beret you’re wearing is navy or black?
Navy
Simon, this coat is fantastic, love the design and fabric! However, wearing the beret I think does indeed put you in dandy territory which should be avoided. What about wearing a classic flat cap instead? Regarding sizing: I currently own the Private White bomber jacket in size five. Would you recommend the same size for this overcoat? You’re collaboration with Private White was a stroke of genius so, please continue doing so. This company makes some of the finest outerwear in the world and the PS pea coat, along with several other pieces, are on my to purchase list.
Thanks Scott – yes I’d stick with the same sizing, so a 5 (Large)
You apparently spend your entire life in dandy territory. Men who actually are masculine don’t follow men’s style blogs, and don’t seek styling advice from marketeers. Worn as it should be worn, pulled forward to a point shading the face, there is nothing of the dandy about the beret. However self-conscious and attention-seeking you and your style guru may be, In no sense are Occitanian or Basque farmers well described as dandys, nor either the generations of Italian workers for whom the black Basco Roma was standard apparel.
Larry, this feels a little like a needlessly aggressive comment. You can make the point about the beret’s origins (and perhaps, for balance, why it now has different connotations) without making such assumptions about Scott.
In future please try to be more civil or the comment won’t be posted. Thanks a lot
Are there any hat styles you’d recommend that have the same practical advantages of the beret without being… well, a beret?
Not quite the same. With men’s hats you’re largely limited to:
– Felt hats (fedoras and similar brimmed hats)
– Caps (flat caps, eight-piece caps, and at a push baseball caps)
– Beanies or watch caps
None of them have quite the same qualities as a beanie, in terms of being able to roll up easily and protect – a beanie or watch cap probably comes closest. Or perhaps a very soft, unlined hat than can be rolled. But that’s still rather bulky.
Sorry Simon but you are wearing your beret badly!
As you wear it, it is reflecting a military item, normally formed to allow the insignia of a regiment to be worn on the high end of it above your forehead.
In Paris, this is not how to wear it, It is more worn like a pudding on your head. Why do you pretend to know when you are wrong my friend?
Come to Paris and I will give to you a lesson!!
Good courage
Herve
You will never, ever, see a Frenchman wearing one so.
Thanks for the tutorial Herve. I am still in the early days of wearing this, so it’s good to have the input. I personally think this style of wearing it suits me better, and don’t mind if it is a more military style. But good to always know the traditions before you go against them!
With all due respect to Herve here. The beret is a very traditional item originating in the Béarn region and very popular in the French and Spanish Basque Country. Its use by sheperds and later city dwellers long predates its army adoption. And please, spare me how you wear it in Paris. If you want to see how the beret is truly worn, walk around San Sebastian, Bilbao, Biarritz or Saint Jean de Luz. You will see plenty of elegantly dressed people wearing them. The high end of the beret should be worn at the back of your head as there is no emblem to be shown (unless you are in the army) and it should be slightly tilted to one side. You were almost on the spot Simon. It used to be said that no self-respecting adult should leave the house without one, no matter the season of the year. I cannot remember my grandfather without one.
The beret is truly a “permanent style” hat. Hasn’t changed in centuries. No sign of dandyism, at least not in its original contexts.
Hmmm.
As worn in the picture, the beret would pass inspection if you were a Red Devil. Otherwise, you could be channelling your inner Frank Spencer, which is probably a look best avoiding.
Regarding warmth, it would be easy to add a zip in/out shell lining of eg Thinsulate, which would solve the issue completely.
Hello P.F.
Why are you attack me? I know the home of the beret of course, but only say that Simon is wear it like a soldier and is wrong!
Maybe Paris, or Marseilles, or Biarritz will show you how to.
Not pulled to the ear is the good way. Please be kind!
Good courage!
My apologies if my comment came over as rude. I found your comment a tad patronising with your Paris reference. As it happens I am quite passionate about berets. Runs in the family. Anyway, peace man and wear the beret however you want.
Not a patronise! I live in Paris so that is why!
There is always the tweed fisherman’s HAT, much like a combination of a regular cotton poplin fisherman’s hat, and a garrison cap, it has the narrow brim of the cotton fisherman’s hat, but with the crown of the garrison cap. Think Sean Connery in Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade.
Is there a refund if we aren’t keen on it? Obviously tags on etc.
Keen to differentiate between that and size returns!
Yes, any return in a sellable condition within the time limit is viable for a refund.
Thanks. Presume time limit is a week or so?
Fourteen days – details in the Ts and Cs here.
Morning Simon,
Will this coat also be sold by Private White VC? I always prefer visiting their London store to try on for size and feel.
Thanks
Hi Mike, yes it will be but not yet
Hi Simon, the coat looks amazing! Two questions:
1) Are the sleeve measurements from nape or raglan sleeve measurements?
2) Are there any plans to make the coat in a slightly heavier cloth? I love the color of the donegal, however am based in the northeast of the U.S. where winters can get quite cold.
Thanks
1- I’ll double check
2- No, sorry
Checked. The sleeve measurement is from the side of the neck – basically the length of that seam that runs up the top of the sleeve, all the way until it meets the collar
Thank you for clarifying Simon, appreciate it.
This is extremely tempting. When scrolling down through the article, I was convinced it was going to be well over £1,000. At that price I’m going to have to give it some serious consideration.
Shallow person that I am, this coat brings to mind the one Daniel Day Lewis sports during his countryside jaunts in Phantom Thread, especially in the final landscape shot in the article. Can I ask where the photos were shot?
A few different places – all on the north coast of Northern Ireland
There is a least one spot that needs to get their ragwort under control.
Monsieur Anonymous is correct, this is tres ‘Phantom Thread’ and nothing wrong with that. What a veritable flaneur’s smorgasbord of a movie that was.
Simon, I love the idea of cashmere lined pockets and I’ve actually considered trying it on a coat of mine. I assume lining existing pockets wouldn’t be too hard for a skilled tailor, but do you know where one could buy cashmere for that?
No, it wouldn’t be that hard.
Not sure whether you could buy a small length like that though – either way, best for the tailor to try and source it probably
I’m about to do the same thing on a leather jacket so I’ll let you know how I get on too!
Hi Simon,
Found the original comment so I’ll pick it up here. I take it you never went through with this then?
No, I didn’t, but I think I simply forgot – I didn’t go through and find I couldn’t.
Just as a note for yr reference; I’m a man who owns many, many overcoats, including vintage ones from the 1930s through 1970s that I’ve inherited, and the first thing that goes out on an overcoat is the pocket lining, following by shoulder lining in the center over the middle back where it is pleated on a good quality coat. I would be concerned over the cashmere wearing out quickly as cashmere has a tendency to do…..On that note, my favorite pocket linings are either moleskin, or very hearty 12-13 oz brushed cotton twill, think winter chino trouser material, but more crisp and stiff, which is what is in several of my tweed topcoats from the 1930s. My raglan Donegal herringbone twill tweed overcoat also has the crescent shaped inset in the collar. It is a wonderfully functional structural thing, mine however has a button through collar point with a small corozo button on the underside of the opposing collar and more dramatically pointed collar points.
Thanks Evan. This is thick cashmere and I’ve used the bridge coat one heavily. But not fore decades yet….
The issue of wear over decades was my point of concern. I’m sure that in the relative short term, say 5 to 7 years it shouldn’t be any major problem. Of course, I am terribly hard on my overcoat pockets and have been known to store anything from a bottle of wine or cognac, to a small carbine or hunting knife in the side slash pockets of my overcoats. I of course wear mine while shooting on occasion….so there is that. But bottles of liquor while walking from my car to the front door of a friend’s house can be surprisingly deleterious to the linings of one’s overcoat pockets! 🙂
Replacing pockets every seven years is fairly cheap maintenance as well
I also love the lined pockets, it’s something that I look for now in winter coats, although I have never done this with cashmere for durability reasons. Thick wale corduroy has been the fabric of choice for me as it has a cozy feel and is also quite durable.
Looks both beautiful and flexible Simon. I would also add that with Cordings’ pricing for a similar coat being nearly £600 I’m pleasantly surprised at the price (the advantages of not having to pay Piccadilly rates & rents I assume).
However, you would launch this just days after I found/bought the relevant Cordings’ coat on Marrkt after having been keeping an eye out for one since your last post on it!
Well, I suppose I at least I have a back up plan if the Cordings’ coat doesn’t fit. Or if I just talk myself into the upgrade!
Apologies for replying to myself, but I wanted to let people know the coat didn’t fit and is on its way back to Marrkt so I assume it will pop up there again shortly.
I found it ran quite large (it’s a 42 according to Marrkt) even accounting for the fact I’d be happy with a looser first in something like this.
Opportune timing with Friday”s post.
I’m close to Sam in having a few coats now, and also wondering how much wear I’d get out of a coat of this (relatively light) weight in Canada–likely limited to only part of the spring and fall, unfortunately.
Does the coat have any structure inside it? Or is this a fully unstructured garment that just drapes from the shoulders?
There’s light canvas in the front, on the placket etc. but no shoulder padding
Hi Simon, I was recently in contact with Private White about this coat and they informed me the canvas is fused. I’m not as familiar with standards when it comes to outerwear, but I know fused canvas tends to carry a negative connotation (I gather largely due to durability/longevity). Is it not as big of a deal in a coat like this because it presumably would undergo less dry cleaning than a sport coat, therefore the risk of the glue melting and bubbling is lower?
I’m sure not all fused canvassing is equal, as well. I’m familiar with Private White products and know they are top quality, so don’t mean to be casting doubt, more just curious.
Hi,
I think there might have been a little confusion between you and PWVC.
Most ready-made coats like this hardly use any canvas, fused or floating. And that’s the case here – there is no canvas down the front, as there would be in a sports jacket or tailored overcoat. The only fusing is a little bit around the collar, and that’s not something there would be any advantage in leaving floating.
This structural difference is one reason I’ve never done tailored outerwear like a polo coat or ulster coat as a RTW collaboration.
Hope that makes sense
Simon
Very helpful, thanks Simon!
Hi Simon,
Great looking coat. It’s exactly what I’m after this season. Sizing question though: I wear a 38R typically, though may be more closely a 39. 40 tends to seem a bit large unless the fit is slim. My favorite jackets have the same chest measurements as the size small in this coat, so I am guessing a Small might be too constricting over tailoring for me and a medium would be best?
Yes, it sounds like a medium might be better over tailoring
how is it against the wind? A coat like this you want to be an impenetrable shield.
Also – isn’t this what we would call a balmaccan?
It’s good, though something heavier would always be a bit better. And yes, it’s a balmacaan style
Wonderful coat! May i ask you what exactly is that insert? I it something like an interlining in a shirt collar making the collar stiffer?
No, it’s made of the external cloth itself. It’s sometimes called a banana shape because of its curve. You can just about see it on the picture – the copper rivets are in it
Thank you! I think I can see it now. I was looking for something rather small but it’s quite deep, isnt’t it? What does it do from the technical point of view to help the collar staying up?
Yes. I’m not sure how to describe what it does, except give the collar greater stability and support at the base
Nice one! I can see where one of the previous comments, which raises the question of you becoming too ‘trendy’ or hipster is coming from, however, I ABSOLUTELY love the beret. I’m afraid I would be too shy to wear it myself (maybe one day!) but I love the look on you. It also made me think of how many various clothing options men in the past had, seems like the modern man is limited to t-shirt and jeans most of the time.
Also, can this be worn with the collar down, all you photos show you with it standing up
Thanks Nick.
Yes, it can definitely be worn with the collar down. I just wouldn’t wear it that way.
Simon, can you provide cloth details on the green flannel trousers by Pommella? Thanks
Sure, let me check
Did you find them Simon?
Just heard – it’s Caccioppoli 570307, 480g
But I thought you generally recommend English flannel over Italian?
I do, if the colours are all the same. But I find it hard to find the right shade of green
I rather like the beret. Where is it from?
Many thanks, Simon. I live in a tropical climate and only need a proper coat when travelling to the colder regions. This provides exactly the versatility I need for a week of say a couple of business meetings, a family dog walk, an afternoon near the beach and a night out in town. Perfect, just ordered one.
So pleased Jan, thanks
Hi Simon, coat arrived and I love it. Thanks again. I was surprised by how light it is though. Perhaps it is the fact that I have been in South Asia for the past 7-8 years but I need a heavier cloth to get me through “most of a UK winter”. Brrr. Will solve with extra layers and scarf etc.
Interesting, thanks Jan. I guess the English winters are fairly variable, unlike US or Scandinavia etc
I quite like the beret, and in no way see it as a step towards dandyism. The beret is a classic,
although maybe a bit eccentric depending on where you live. Simon I appreciate your fashion explorations and while they may not all work for me they often get me to think about trying something new, something a little more personal. I think we should embrace individuality and keep a little fun in dressing well. While you know the “rules” you have enough confidence to express yourself by trying new things.
Thanks. Maybe I should have used the post to launch berets…
If you’re interested in launching some form of cap please consider a flat cap instead of a beret. A PS designed flat cap would be very useful and more practical in my opinion. The beret is difficult to wear well and has an unfortunate propensity to make a man look like a dandy or somewhat effeminate. Best to leave this style to the French.
If this verges on light… What is a heavy cloth good for winter coating?
Have a read of our article on overcoatings… plenty of info there – https://www.permanentstyle.com/2018/12/the-guide-to-overcoating-cloths.html
This is a beautiful coat, my compliments Simon. You made excellent design decisions, particularly with the longer length, well done. I would advise against wearing a beret as the style tends toward the effeminate and looks way too French quite frankly.
Simon, did Mallalieus weave the Bridge coat cloth?
No
Simon,
Congratulations on probably your best design / product to date. So much refinement and versatility. Really nice! I’m definitely tempted to buy one…
Hi Simon, will you be adding size 36”? Private White’s size 2? That would be kind.
I won’t be, no. Sorry. Private White might have some in the future though
What’s the reason for this? I normally take a 36 and would consider it a fairly common size.
We’re a small company and can’t afford to do extra sizes unfortunately. The only thing we did do that with was the Bridge Coat, and almost none of the XS or XXL have sold!
I’m indulging in a little bit of comparative sizing with my morning coffee, maybe someone will find it useful. Otherwise, hey, I like numbers. TL;DR, Simon sizes are one or two sizes smaller than Private White sizes.
The chest and waist garment measurements of the PS Donegal in size S are 106 cm and 109 cm, respectively.
My Private White Twin Track jacket has chest and waist measurements of 106 cm and 102 cm, in size XS.
And the PS bridge coat has chest and waist measurements of 106 cm and 101 cm – in size M.
My Private White Jaguar jacket measures 109 cm and 106 cm in chest and waist, in size XS, the smallest sold.
The PS trench coat is available in 109 cm and 105 cm in the chest and waist. This is size S and would probably fit me nicely in the shoulders when wearing a jacket underneath.
My question about size XS in the Donegal came from my three coats and jackets from Private White, all in size XS. All fit over a jumper but not over a tailored jacket.
But, if I tried on a PS bridge coat in size XS with measurements of 94 cm and 89 cm in chest and waist, I think I’d not be able to close it while exhaling in a t-shirt. A medium (106-101) would be a bit tight on the shoulders when worn over tailoring, but a large (113-108) perhaps roomy.
In any case I can easily understand that the bridge coat XS does not sell very well, it is at least a whole size smaller than Private White’s offerings in size XS.
The Donegal in XS would be too small for me, too.
Thanks Stefan, I’m sure this is very useful. However, Private White sizes and mine are the same. They also sell the trench coat and the bridge coat, in the same sizes, and the sizing is determined by them, not me.
I think the difference you’re referring to is just the fact that different pieces in the Private White range are cut differently. The bridge coat, for example, is cut with slightly larger shoulders to fit over a suit jacket, but that’s the same cut as the cashmere pea coat PW used to do
Hi Simon. I think you are right, but, whereas you are thinking about cut, I am just comparing the letter sizes. They don’t match:
The PW peacoat has a 99 cm chest in size 2, and the PS bridge coat has a 94 cm chest in size 2. The bridge coat is actually not roomier in the shoulders if you compare the same size. It is less roomy in the same size. And there is a 12 cm difference at the waist, the peacoat has a 101 cm waist but the bridge coat has an 89 cm waist, both in XS.
Now, if you compare cuts, like I think you are really doing, then the bridge coat is roomier in the shoulders: The XS PW peacoat has a waist measurement of 101 cm and if I were to buy a bridge coat with the same waist measurement of 101 cm it would have an extra 7 cm of room in the chest – 106 cm instead of 99 cm. But the size label would say M, not XS.
I’m planning to order that one from you, one of these days, by the way. And was quite surprised that I need an M.
Incidentally, the PW “deluxe cashmere” peacoat seems to have a 106 cm chest in size XS. That is completely different than the bridge coat, 12 cm roomier in the same size. If I were to buy that cashmere peacoat, I’d be back to size XS. But maybe you are thinking of the older model peacoats, with the flap pockets.
Yes, I think that was an older model.
There are certainly big differences here, but my point was that these are all Private White VC pieces. The Bridge Coat is something they sized and put their numbering on, in the same way they did the pea coat. If you go into their store, all these pieces are next to each other, with the same numbering and sizing that they have determined. I helped with design and cut, but the sizing is theirs. They just have these differences in their range.
Simon,
That beret looks so at home on you! Well done with the overcoat!
About the beret – I come to this site to find something new, something exciting as well as the rules of menswear, and how to pair colours.
The beret is something that would never have crossed my mind, but now it has, maybe one day I’ll be brave enough to go for it
Thanks Simon – you’re great
I like this, Simon!
I have a similarly styled Burton’s overcoat that was my Grandfather’s, he got it just after the War when he was on his way to America and had stopped off in England briefly.
His is in a creamy marled chestnut/caramel brown alternating with antique ivory in large scale herringbones with mostly rusty red Donegal boule flecks. The fabric is at least 16 oz., and the half herringbones are at least half an inch to 3/5ths of an inch in length. The coat is simply cut, also with raglan sleeves, has no cuff detailing whatsoever, but does have rather longish sleeves, but all of the paneled seams on both the body and the sleeves are welted! It has very large corozo buttons on the front which are visible and in a luscious burnt caramel color, and a small one under the collar. The collar is more dramatically pointed than yrs here, but it also has little turn backs near the collar, like miniature lapels that one might find on a sport shirt. On the left collar point, there is a button , as well as at the throat so that the collar can be buttoned across entirely, ditto in the vent up the back. My Grandfather’s and now my jacket flares out from the arm pit at roughly a 15 degree angle, and has side slash pockets lined in very plush brushed cotton twill. It is my favorite coat, followed by my vintage Brooks Brothers cashmere Chesterfield with its velvet collar and full silk lining. In my opinion, with a balmacaan coat, the breadth of the skirting is key to an elegant and easy fit and tasteful drape to the garment. This one you’ve brought forth is very handsome!
Simon, what a lovely coat, and perfect timing as I’m in the market…
I have a loosely related question: you mention the cashmere pocket lining. Do you think cashmere lining in suit pockets suitable, or too warm? Or is there another reason to avoid such linings?
Generally it would be too bulky Luke, unless the jacket cloth were pretty heavy
£954 vs. Cording’s £595 for its ‘Follifoot’ Donegal. The advantages of the PS are superior design (esp. neck area), pocket lining, buttons and the smaller run. It also seems to drape and shape better. The disadvantages of the Donegal is that it is not showerproof, not really warm enough for colder weather etc. but there are few other outerwear garments that really chime with a sports jacket and flannels (Barbour is a standby but not always suitable). It is, undoubtedly, better with the beanie but no shame in trying the beret. The issue, particularly in the UK and outside of military association, is the ‘Frank Spencer’ link that renders it at best a comedy piece, or conversely, a Che Guevara revolutionary reference. For civilian purposes, outside of France, it has never quite taken off – in Germany, Italy, Holland etc. it is rarely seen though it has had some recognition in Spain. Better a ‘Baker Boy’ cap reversed and more in keeping with the Donegal’s traditions?
Yes, I think it’s all about the associations. And I think most people today would not make the Frank Spencer connection. But you never know. I link it to Gene Krell, a personal inspiration, and to images of Laurel and Hardy wearing them in their later years.
Like most wool coats, by the way, this Donegal can deal with a shower. Just hang it and let it dry at home – it will be none the worse.
In fact, it was worn in showers for most of this shoot! You can see the rain in the top harbour shot, if you look carefully
Ooh Betty, the pussycat’s done a whoopsey in my beret.
Never seen Krell wear one.
Read the interview
I would have gone with ‘Citizen Smith’, but to each their own.
Although I’m tempted by the coat, I have had sizing issues with Private White VC’s outerwear in the past so will most likely wait until it is available to try on in its store. I have a Twin Track in Size 3 which is slightly too snug around the arms, while a subsequent jacket I purchased from them in a Size 4 is too large.
I know what you mean about sizing. I got the PS trench coat in size 2 and it was very good; maybe just a touch snug with the lining inside.
With the PS Bridge Coat, I tried to go up to a size 3 given it was slimmer fit, and that was too tight in the chest. Upgraded to a size 4, and it was still too tight.
It’s tough for RTW retailers to design the perfect coat to fit everyone. In general, the Cordings fit is fine for me and friends who also shop there. Simon has shoulders that slope more than most men’s and that could be a contributing factor to the collar problems. Perhaps he could comment on that possibility.
Thankfully, Cordings have brought back the Follifoot this year and the chocolate herringbone donegal looks great. It’s the casual alternative to the covert coat and the temptation will be difficult to resist. Sadly, it would hard to justify another grey overcoat as I have major house refurbishment costs to fund this month.
Simon,
This is a sartorial masterpiece and I must have one.
That said, I will need PW to measure me up. Do they have samples in Marylebone and will I be able to place an order ex-factory ?
Once again a huge bravo but, the beret …………..ok I won’t say “I’ve had a lot of worries Betty”.
Private White will at some point, yes
Absolutely beautiful coat, Simon, very well done! Do you think this could be my one overcoat to keep forever and ever? I’m a young guy working in the City of London and wear a worsted suit (and often a tie) into work most days, but equally I spend the rest of the time in knitwear, jeans, chukka boots etc.
If not, any recommendations near the £1000 bracket? Thanks!
If anything could bridge those two worlds, I think this one could W.
The only concern would be the office environment. Perhaps have a look at what others wear. If anyone is in a Barbour or anything similarly casual, you’ll be absolutely fine.
Love the coat, but I’m more interested in the green flannel. Have, blue, grey but green is something I’ve been looking for for ages!
Nice coat!
Do you think the XL would fit someone with a size 50 UK / 60 EU?
As well, during a basted fitting I noticed the tailor hanged the overcoat over not one but two hangers, placed one behind the other. Would you advise doing this at home too to preserve the shoulder shape?
I think it might be too small unfortunately, but worth checking the measurements against something you already own to get the best idea.
Using a thicker hanger or two hangers can be a nice idea, but more with something that has a shoulder pad to preserve the shape of. Less needed with something like this
I have SEH Kelly’s Balmacaan in Donegal tweed – they’ve done it for the past few years I think. I really love it. Was that coat any inspiration here? This appears to be slightly longer.
No, I haven’t tried SEH Kelly’s version
Have you ever / would you ever / would would the effects be of a waterproofing spray on an overcoat (or suede shoes for that matter)
It works on suede shoes, but not on an overcoat… at the very least, it would have to be something smooth and densely woven, like a ventile cotton or similar
But no harm in trying?
I’m not sure if there’s any chance of harm. I’m more sure it wouldn’t do anything.
Hi Simon,
I like this coat very much and hopefully my search for a new winter coat this year is soon to be over. I think it bridges the gap between something a little edgy with a more traditional design, (eg I’d been looking at a duffle without a hood, but feel this coat has a more mature styling), plus it has what looks to be some design features which enhance the look. I recently tried on the brown coat you mentioned and the low fit around the neck was the deal breaker for me. Many of the other features look well thought through and the drape whilst A-line doesn’t appear over done or too oversized – an expensive mistake I made last year!
I agree with the comment on the price, which is very reasonable when taking design, materials (etc.) into account. Finally whilst I expect to purchase, as with one of the other comments, I prefer to try on something like a coat in a shop, ( although I still got it a bit wrong last year!) so will go to the Private White shop when it arrives.
I tend to fall into the having trouble doing online returns category! I’ll comment again when I have been into PW.
Regarding the other comments on your evolving style, it’s just that – ‘evolving’. If you didn’t try new things (although I would tend to exclude tattoos from this), you don’t grow and progress, and learn sometimes from mistakes.
Well done on a great piece of form and function design . Keep up the great work and keeping us on our toes – we all need it sometimes.
This coat is really stunning. Rugged but still seems to work with a sports coat.
I’m about a 54-56 (EU)/44-45 (US) jacket size, should I get the XL or the L?
Probably XL, but do check the measurements against a coat you already have if you can – that’s the safest way
Very Nice Simon 🙂
Re. Gene Krell: I did a search for images but could only find one – he did sport a Rasta cap on one occasion though – he has great hair, almost a pity to cover it up. Other beret icons worth mentioning are Picasso (younger) and Dizzy Gillespie – Gillespie, particularly, was influential on 50’s hipster culture (music and fashion). Hemingway was also a wearer and it was in wide use, by both sides, during the Spanish civil war.
Respectfully, can I suggest the Argentinian beret worn by Gauchos and polo players. Similar to the traditional but slightly larger and coarser in finish. I met some Argentinian polo players wearing same, they were worn with much style and, though related to the French beret, looked quite different (more sporting and less inclined to the intelligentsia in reference).
https://gauchobelts.co.uk/
The beret pic has trigered many comments. Caught my eye as well, not something I expected. I must say however, you look great and remind me of Erroll Flynn in that photo!
BTW, wonderful coat.
Gorgeous overcoat. Length and collar are great, and it looks very versatile. For me, it looks like one of the best things you’ve done. If you ever do another overcoat, perhaps consider something like that Drake’s one from recent seasons: https://putthison.com/get-an-overcoat-this-fall/#jp-carousel-48412
Hi Simon,
This kind of coat deserves to be listed as an essential for a proper winter wardrobe. It’s both useful and stylish! And your twists make this one even more so!
John
Hello Simon!
The coat looks absolutely delightful, but unfortunately as a resident of somewhere that does get well and truly cold for more than half the year, the lower weight means that it’s just really not practical. Would you & Private White ever consider doing another run in a heavier cloth? Or, failing that, how would you rate the Cording’s coat in terms of overall warmth?
Perhaps, yes, though a coat in this style is never going to be super warm. It won’t belt or button in the warmth.
The Cordings one will be no warmer
Color wise, are these green flannels the exact same as your Elia Caliendo green flannels? What’s the difference and which do you wear more?
Would you consider these trousers forest green or dark olive?
They’re a shade darker, and I probably wear them more as a result. I’d describe them as dark olive
Could you comment on the new tariffs going into effect on English clothing and how that will affect those of us buying from the US. The tariffs mention suits and outerwear made in the UK. Will this affect jackets/sport coats? What about things from Whitcomb and Shaftesbury that are cut in the UK but sewn in elsewhere (Specific question here as I had a first fitting yesterday)? Will this affect the your own Donegal Overrcoat?
It’s hard to tell, particularly with Brexit and new potential trade deals
Beautiful looking coat, Simon. Could you describe what the interior pockets are like? On the bridge coat, I love the higher interior pocket, which allows me to slip my cell phone (mobile for you Brits :)) in and out when the coat is buttoned up. Does the Donegal coat have a similar pocket? Does it also have a poacher’s pocket, like the Bridge coat does? (the poacher’s pocket is perfect for gloves or for a watch cap).
PS – I really love the cashmere lining on the interior pockets–they really feel wonderful. That said, I imagine it’s probably best to avoid putting keys in those pockets.
Thanks.
On the pockets, sure. There isn’t the vertical pocket, as on the Bridge Coat. It seemed to make less sense on a single-breasted coat like this, but I know what you mean about the functionality. Instead this has two internal breast pockets, and yes then that nice large poacher’s pocket, buttoned.
Which is heavier / warmer, this or your cordings version? I overhear so want to think about that
They’re pretty much the same
I suffer 3 issues with outerwear-
1) I work in the sartorially challenged world of IT, where Barbour is considered “smart” and M&S is de-rigueur, in my early 30s finding a balance between looking really smart, feeling good and enjoying tailoring, without looking relatively foppish is always tough.
2) As a consultant a week can change from jumper, to blazer, to suit as I try to match my client’s offices. Carrying all three on the train is challenge enough without multiple coats as well; a coat that will fit a canvased suit under it, but not drown me when only wearing a shirt is a tall order.
3) At 5,8″ ‘proper’ length coats can often make me look even shorter.
I can gladly say having received this coat and spent all weekend trying it on with almost every outfit I own; it truly seems to be a panacea to the above. I can’t wait to get a lifetime of use out of it!
Amazing! So pleased…
One question I do have, which i may have missed in the posts, what is the functional purpose of the button in the vent?
To keep the vent closed if you want to for warmth or when it’s particularly windy
WG,
As someone who seems about the same size as you and who wants the same versatility out of the coat, what size did you go with? I am very torn between the 38 and 40. Now that they are back in stock I was thinking of trying one but feel stuck, and buying from the US if I need to return is something of a pain. Any advice you can give would be wonderful, thanks!
Hi WG, being of the same height, I was wondering if you like the default length on the coat? Or would you have it shortened? Thanks.
Ahh, looks like the Medium has sold out (congratulations!).
Would love to put myself down for a preorder if you’ll take orders for the next batch, Simon.
Absolutely, and I’m sure we’ll get a few exchanges for sizes as well, so do email [email protected] to be on the waiting list
Simon
Got mine yesterday. Think it is really nice. My thoughts are below:
Should definitely be heavier – more of a mid weight coat.
Not sure how hardy the cloth will be with brambles, thorns, general rough and tumble that you get on an Autumn / Winter walk
Cashmere pockets feel nice now but think they will age badly
Would also have gone for pleated vent (don’t know the terminology, you have something similar on the top of your cifonelli overcoat). I feel like this gives more space to step and move
On the whole though a nice item.
Thoughts and comments welcome
Lovely coat, nice material, colour and good fit for me, size 3 my usual PWVC size- 5′ 10″ 10 stone, slim build. It is a mid weight coat so i would need ample knitwear underneath on a coldish day here in NE Scotland. I have tried it with sports jacket and knitwear and it is obviously tighter but works. I could probably wear a size 4 depending on what i wore underneath for warmth so that maybe something for others to consider depending on where you live.
There is plenty of room in the bicep area but then tapers considerably so this could be restrictive depending on whats worn underneath.
Also, there needs to be spare buttons that come with the coat, where can i get them from?
Overall very pleased Simon well done!
Simon.
I popped into PWVC’s London store on Saturday and didn’t know how quick to get my wallet out. It’s a sartorial masterpiece – straight out of ‘The Phantom Thread’ playbook. Reynolds Woodcock would be delighted !
The small reservations I had about the lining colour and the weight of the cloth immediately disappeared. The lining us subtle and I actually like the lighter weight. It allows more creativity underneath – as the actress said to the bishop.
Mine has gone back to the factory for alterations ( I prefer them to do it – they are very good and don’t charge) so it will be a couple of weeks before my launch but I can’t wait to get flaneuring.
Bravo a tous . Particularly the great workers at PWVC’s factory.
Jason
Simon, just wanted to let you know that my coat arrived, and I love it! Buying something like this is online is always a bit of a gamble, but this time it certainly worked out. Will be wearing this piece of clothing for many, many years to come.
Oh good. So pleased to hear that Nick
Hi Simon, it looks like the coat is already sold-out. Do you plan on making a waiting list for the next batch? And would you suggest taking the same size as the Bridge coat (everything except the shoulders fit very well, but the shoulders are ideal for suits, as was the idea behind it).
thanks!
We have some coming back from size exchanges now actually – pretty much all sizes. So do email [email protected] to be on the waiting list and we’ll let you know when there is one.
If the body of the Bridge Coat fit you well, then yes I’d go for the same size
Afraid I am returning mine Simon. Like it a lot but a few comments (in case you would like honest feedback):
Cloth should be heavier & denser. The feel would be superior and better use for all seasons.
It is very rare to overheat in a coat like this as you can just leave it open and have a lot of air circulating so there is very little downside to having a really heavy cloth. Better against wind and weather if it were heavier
I would have the collar a tad bigger. Whilst buttoned (v similar proportions to you) it is a bit of a choker and not easy to tuck chin into. I think a marginally larger collar would also make it a lot easier to wear with collar down, lending it a more dramatic sweep
the back – I think a reverse pleat at the back gives a big more flex to the coat and looks far superior – wish it had one.
Cashmere pockets – a tad too warm and concerns about lining giving way
Finally on price. I was surprised on how low it was but even so going in and comparing to Cordings I didn’t really see much benefit in make or design (design being very similar). As such a charcoal loden from Cordings is about £250 cheaper
Finally on personal preference – I know covered placket traditional for this style of coat but I do like a button. Can look smart if in same shade and easier to dress down.
None of this is to say it isn’t a great product. I am just a bit anally retentive and thought I would share my thoughts in case useful (p.s. – surprised not to have any PS branding!)
All very interesting, thanks.
No, we don’t really brand things at the moment. Perhaps we should
I really prefer non-branding (labels mostly kill the product in my opinion). Please don’t start labeling!
Mine has arrived, and it’s a great fit. If I could give my immediate reaction, it was: ‘This coat looks vintage.’ Maybe the reasoning is this: Coats this long are often impressive, but too much so for casual wear. Bridging business and casual with a traditionally cut coat in a more relaxed tweed makes a rare combination today. One’s thoughts are immediately turned to past eras of casual, tweed coats (and I see the Phantom Thread references). Anyway, I mean this highly positively – surely the way classics are made?
In terms of adjustments, I might investigate enlarging the ‘poacher’s pocket’. I’ve no complaints about the current size, but I like the notion of an enormous pocket to take my journal or a book. Perhaps I’m thinking of old films where men didn’t carry bags, but seemed to have an inventory distributed through their coat pockets.
(And to add my vote on weight: I wouldn’t want it any heavier, as I’m mainly in cities such as Tokyo or Melbourne where temperatures feel cold but remain above freezing. A medium weight keeps it flexible, in my view.)
Hi Simon,
I’m looking for a casual coat, preferably in a herringbone/tweed of some kind. This looks like it could be a candidate, but I’m hesitant about the style, having been put off by similar RTW raglan sleeved garments, including the Cordings one, which I find rather tent-like. How would you compare this to the Cordings one (useful that you have both!) in terms of cut/style?
I think you’ll find it similar in terms of body cut – most raglan coats are a little roomy, unless they’re also belted (eg Saman Amel does a good one like that)
Ok, thanks. That’s helpful to know. Raglan seems to be the default design for more casual coats, with other overcoats being more structured and formal, at least in my experience. Perhaps there’s an opportunity for a new, more casual design.
True. The sleeve immediately makes it more casual. The pea coat is probably the most common casual style after that
Hi Simon
I really like the look of this coat, already have the Bridge Coat in a Small and love it but I see Private White are doing this in an extra small version too and I’m just wondering for a better fit would I be better going for it than a normal small. Im only 5ft 8/9 and a bit skinny so I don’t really want the coat to look like it’s hanging on me. I’m a bit worried the sleeves will be right down over my hands. I’m not so worried about the length as I think too many coats these days are too short so if it rains your jeans or trousers get soaked. I guess I could try a small and if it was still big send it back for an extra small if that turned out to be the case.
Have you looked at the measurements of the two? That’s really the only good way to tell.
Thank you for your wonderful site.
Can you write a post or series on the various types of overcoats? I am considering commissioning a winter coat and would have trouble determining the style to request.
Cheers.
Nice idea, yes.
However, do be aware that names and types of coats do vary and don’t mean the same things to everyone. It’s often best to go off images or coats youve already seen that you like.
However, a post like this would be a good basis for those references too
I hope Simon, or perhaps someone else who’s already received his coat, can offer some sizing advice.
The Private White site advises that size 2/XS equates to a size 36-chest jacket. But I see that the chest measurement for an XS coat is 101 cm. That seems awful tight if the coat is meant to fit over a sportcoat or suit jacket. For example, the chestmeasurement for a size 36 Havana jacket at SuitSupply is 102 cm — and that’s a relatively slim cut (in my view, anyway).
Am I right to be concerned that the XS coat wouldn’t fit comfortably over a 36 jacket?
Do you have another coat to compare the measurements to? Or is that what you’re doing here already? That makes the biggest difference
Thanks, Simon. I don’t have a coat in this style, unfortunately, but I suppose I could measure a topcoat that fits me decently and then work from there.
Looking back at the sizing charts, it seems like what’s happening here is that PW’s patterns are graded differently from manufacturers I’m more familiar with. Again using SuitSupply, just as an example — the chest on PW’s size 4 is 3 cm bigger than a SuitSupply Havana jacket, but the chest measurements are the same for size 38/3, and the PW coat is 1 cm smaller for size 36/2. For 42/5, the PW coat is a full 6 cm bigger.
If I were to bet, I’d say that the larger sizes would fit comfortably over an equivalent size sportcoat, but that the fit would be much tighter with the smaller sizes.
Interesting, thank you that’s good to know
Do you have any pleats on your green trouser?
Yes. I normally don’t have them, but was experimenting with forward facing pleats here
And how did that turn out in comparison to no pleats?
OK, but the pleats don’t function that well – flat fronts would have been better
Which pants do you usually assign flat fronts to? Wouldn’t this green pant look nicer with one reverse pleat over flat fronts? Is there an advantage with one look over the other? I know you say it’s personal preference but why go flat front?
I usually have a single pleat, and only on trousers I want to be slightly smarter.
This was an experiment, but not one I’d repeat. Always good to have your preferences reconfirmed!
Since flannels sit right in the middle of the formality scale, and these are green flannels (a casual color), you would prefer no pleats for a casual look? Sorry, just trying to figure out why no pleats would be chosen over one.
Yes to be slightly more casual.
Is there another batch planned for next year? I am currently saving up for the coat but as it looks it goes fast every time it becomes available. And sadly, things seem to get more expensive at PWVC (on their website) by the day to by from them directly.
There certainly will be another batch next year, yes. And we currently have seven in stock, in all sizes except XL
With the weight of these green trousers do you have daks or side adjusters? Great website Simon!
Thank you, lovely to hear. Do spread the word!
Side adjustors.
I do! Oh but aren’t these trousers quite heavy, which would require daks?
No, not that heavy. A mid-weight flannel
Hi Simon,
Regarding the weight, it’s been described as being mid-weight by many people in the comments down below. However 620 grams is the same as the bridge coat, your Cifonelli overcoat and I guess very similar to the 21oz of your Sexton coat. Besides the fact that it’s single breasted, how warm do you think this coat is? How would it work if the temperature was below 0? I appreciate it depends on what you have underneath of course, but I guess the question is if it would be practical to wear it those days that the temperature is indeed below 0 (say up to -5C).
Thanks!
Hi Noel,
No it wouldn’t really. It’s not a deep winter coat.
It might be fairly heavy, but it’s a slightly loose weave, wool not cashmere, and slightly loose in the fit. Plus no DB
Personally, I’ve been wearing it in Canada in temperatures a little below 0 Celsius and have found it good for this weather. Today I was wearing it with a shetland sweater underneath in -2 degrees weather.
I won’t be wearing it once winter hits through (-15 to -25 Celsius).
I worked for a high end private label sportswear company in Boston many years, Halrin Ltd. Founded originally on Essex St downtown as a men’s pants mfg (Halrin Slack), we made beautiful sportcoats for the natural shoulder brown shoes trade. Donegal Tweed is a gorgeous fabrication and worth every penny.
Hi Simon,
What is the fabric for your most recently commissioned navy overcoat (by Michael Browne)? I couldn’t find a wool blend with >20% cashmere. Cheers
Holland & Sherry 986021
Hi Simon
Would it be worth getting a bespoke raglan, or would an altered RTW be just as good considering the looseness of fit?
It would be pretty close to the same, as long as you could get cloth, length, sleeves etc that all worked for you.
Bespoke would be better quality in some ways, eg a handmade canvas
I can only echo the previous comments – its indeed a beautiful coat! However, I’m a bit suprised that none of the feedback mentioned the tight sleeves. I’ve got fairly thin arms by any standards and can hardly get a jacket through the sleeves on this coat. It’s a shame because I would like to be able to wear it with a suit or blazer and going up in size would ruin the other proportions which fit great.
One or two people did mention it Alex, and it’s something I’ll feed back to PWVC.
Hi Simon,
I love, love this coat! It would be great for my son, but I am worried about the size as he is 6’3″ and very slim. What are the length of the sleeves in the size medium? I’m even wondering if the boxy style would be too loose…something tailored might be better.
Hi Jane,
The measurements are at the bottom of the post – the sleeve is measures from the end, up the middle of the sleeve, to wear it meets the collar at the top.
The style of the jacket is to be loose, so I think it depends most on whether he would like that style. If he would, the fit wouldn’t make too much difference. It could also be slimmed a little by a local tailor
Great looking coat!
Out of curiosity, why did you go for a gold-colored lining? I really like the subtleness of the coat exterior, but would have expected a more muted lining.
Regards,
Alexander
It was a colour we used first in the Bridge Coat last year, and found it to be quite sophisticated – distinctive but still subtle
Hello Simon,
one question to find the right size of this wonderful coat:
I am 183cm tall, weigh 76kg´s and my chest measurement is 97cm.
My jackets have the size 48 (Lardini, Caruso).
I prefer “slim-fit”.
Is S the right size?
Unfortunately I do not have a coat that actually fits me to take measurements.
By the way: is the coat good for temperatures between zero to six degrees (celsius) – winter-temperature in western germany.
Greatings from Germany 🙂
Raphael
Hi Raphael,
It’s really hard to say, because even people with the same chest measurement will want something in a different size – it’s a matter of style and taste as well as your body shape. And of course it depends what you wear under it.
If I had to guess, I’d say S would be your size, yes. But measuring another coat will always be best.
Lastly no, I wouldn’t really say it was a good coat for those temperatures. It’s more for 4-10 degrees
Hello and good evening,
I forgot to ask:
do you have the shoulder-measurements for this coat in “S”?
A 48-jacket has aprox 44/45 cm. Does that fit under the S-Coat?
🙂
Thank you and take care.
It’s a raglan sleeve, so there is no shoulder measurement really – there is no point to the shoulders! This is why we give the chest measurement
I just received mine in the size 3 (38) and it’s a wonderful piece. It’s one of the nicest things I own, and a splendid balance between sumptuous and casual. I work in a creative field and I think it nails the formality level. The sizing is perhaps a little tricky for me, but I’ll leave my example for the benefit of others who are pondering. I’m 174cm and a reasonably slim build, but with a 38″ chest (measured), but my normal jacket size tends to be 36R. The size 3 is perfect with a chunky sweater on underneath, and with tailoring it works; it’s maybe a *touch* constricting with folded arms, but I know that a size 4 would hang on me, so I will take the trade-off of the coat looking great for most of the outfits I would pair it with over absolute accommodation. The coat falls 1 cm below my kneecap (the bottom of the patella), as Simon describes it does on him. The only other piece of outerwear I own, I can compare the overcoat (size 3) to a Norwegian Rain Single-Breasted Homme raincoat (M). The Donegal is slightly more accommodating, partly on account of it’s entirely made of natural fibers that stretch.
This is wear-forever piece. I love it.
*…only other piece of LONG outerwear, I should say.
That’s so, so nice to hear Dan. Thank you
My coat arrived a couple of days ago. I had a hard time ordering the coat, because it was – in my world – a lot of money. but it was with it. the coat works casual and business 🙂
looks and fells awesome and it is a really a great difference to all these parka-jackets (e.g. Canada goose, whoolrich or stone-island) you can see downtown in Germany
Keep up the great work and thanks for this great coat.
(I have ordered size “S” – I have a size 48 in Lardini oder Caruso-suits).
I wish this existed in a woman’s size.
Sorry Tule. Private White do do some in XS in case that helps
When could we expect a restock? Winter approaches in Australia.
Not until our Autumn I’m afraid Danny
Hello Simon, I recently got the coat in size XS from Private White.
The coat is marvellous however, as I am a relatively short man, some necessarily are required. My biggest concern is the waist. I do understand the coat is supposed to be a bit roomy, but it is a big difference comparing to the Bridge coat. I am wondering how much can the waist be taken in? And would you recommend Pinnas & Needles to alter?
Yes, the fit is pretty much the exact opposite of the Bridge Coat. It is suppose to be roomy, but also falling straight from the shoulders – so you shouldn’t take it in at the waist, but rather narrow it all the way down if you want to.
I wouldn’t do it more than an inch on both sides, but yes it’s something Pinnas could do
Thanks for you reply Simon. I will consider to narrow it down.
Regarding the Bridge coat, as I had gained some weight over the past year, will it be possible to take out some of the Vatican and make it bigger? It’s feeling rather snug if not too small at the moment.
I assume you mean ‘back’ rather than ‘Vatican’?!
Yes it is possible to let a little out, but not much. We said around 2cm each side.
Thanks for your reply Simon.
And yes I do mean the back, my biggest concern is the central box pleat, it tends to burst out when I button up the front.
OK. Yes I would take it to an alterations tailor and ask to do as much as they can
Hi Simon,
Will the second iteration of the coat be exactly the same, to are you going to change some elements? Denser cloth and inverted back pleat have been mentioned a couple of times and I think both are good suggestions.
We are considering a heavier/denser cloth, yes, but otherwise the design won’t change. An inverted back wouldn’t be that clean and a bit too much like a Loden coat for me. We will also slightly widen the sleeves though, as that was something a few people fed back on
Can I please put my hand up for nothing to change design or cloth wise?
I don’t think I could use it if it was any heavier (Australia). For me the current weight suits the product’s mandate of versatility, anything heavier might reduce its total use cases if that makes sense?
Hey Danny, yes it does and thank you, vote noted
I loved the cloth, but unfortunately the cut of the RTW coat didn’t suit me. Would you consider making the cloth available in the same way as the escorial cloth, so that lengths could be bought for a tailor to make a bespoke coat?
Good point RT, no I hadn’t thought of that. It might be hard as we’re using all we can get as it is, but I’ll raise it.
Thanks
Based on some of the earlier comments, I take it you’re planning on restocking this coat in the fall (pandemic permitting)? If so, I’d like to add my vote to keeping the weight the same – if it’s really cold, you can always layer up, but you can’t do the reverse…
As an aside, how would you compare the level of formality of this coat with the bridge coat?
Thanks, yes we are, and that’s good to know.
I think the bridge and donegal coat are similar in terms of formality, but for different reasons. The short length of the bridge coat makes it less formal, but the navy cloth makes it more so. The opposite is true for the donegal.
Still, of the two I’d be more likely to wear the donegal with a smart suit.
Assuming one owns both, which would you use / would work better for a particular occasion? The colors are versatile and go with similar things, and as you mentioned, the level of formality is pretty similar.
I think I’d be more likely to wear the donegal with a suit, to the office or a meeting and so on. The bridge coat more casually with a jacket every day, or with knitwear.
I think it’s because the length of the donegal just makes a bit more of a difference than the material, when it comes to smartness.
Ideally I wouldn’t own both unless I also had, for example, a smarter overcoat that would fit better with smart suits though (assuming that was something I wore)
Would you consider doing a capsule for outerwear? I assume, based on previous comments, you would begin with a DB navy overcoat, but then what?
Nice question.
I guess that would be good, though it would quickly have to get rather casual to justify five pieces. So perhaps the navy overcoat, then a grey herringbone, then a raincoat, then a suede blouson etc.
I’ll give it some thought though
I’ve been wondering about this as well. Perhaps five for summer and five for fall/winter?
Perhaps. It’s barely a capsule at that point! But sure
A wonderful coat. The last time I could buy such quality off the rack was at Aquascutum in Regent Street back in the 1980s – all my coats came from them. I am a 52″ chest and 6ft21/2:” tall. The sales assistant would simply ask, “What colour, sir?” Nobody is interested in catering to me today. Please, please, please make for outsizes like me.
Hi Simon,
Will you be restocking this coat for the A/W season? Or perhaps another coat of similar weight? I’m in the market for a coat and always love your pieces, so wanted to check in before I start looking around elsewhere. Thanks.
Yes we will, there’s a waiting list growing if you want to email [email protected] and be put on it.
Great, I’m excited! I assume at this stage you’ve already made all the important design decisions, but as I read you were considering a heavier cloth, if it’s still up in the air, put me down for a yes vote. I live in Boston and this would be the perfect year-round coat over a thick sweater if it had just a little more bulk. But either way, I’ll be putting in a waitlist order. Thanks!
Great, thanks Jonathan. That is the idea, yes, so it’s more of a real winter coat.
Cheers
Hi Simon,
Does this mean that you’ll be introducing a new cloth/coat this year?
I really liked the cloth of the original coat, but having tried it at the PWVC shop, it didn’t work for me. Would you consider making the cloth available for bespoke making, as you have with your Escorial cloth and shirt fabrics?
Hi RT,
Yes, the donegal coat this year will be in a slightly different cloth – but only slightly. There’s a good chance you’ll like this one too.
On cloth, no I’m afraid it wouldn’t work to supply the material – we couldn’t afford to make a whole piece on top of the coat production.
Sorry
Ok, thanks, Simon.
Shame about the cloth. Unfortunately, the RTW coat wasn’t a good fit for me last year and I ended up buying a raglan from Crombie. I didn’t like the cloth as much, but it was a better fit.
Hi Simon, any chance you could give a rough ETA on the coat? Also, is the price going to be similar to last year?
It should be here in September, and yes the price will be very similar
Hi Smon,
I see that size 2/XS is still available on the Private White website. If I were to purchase it, I would probably need to have it let out slightly at the sides. Has inlay been left at the side seams, if I need to do so?
Thanks in advance for your help!
There is a little, yes, but I wouldn’t take a size down that you would normally have in a piece like this. You don’t want the shoulders or anything else to fit small
Hi Simon – I searched this post out from way back in the past to ask you about one of the design features I’ve been mulling over ever since: the collar insert.
Is this kind of insert something commonly available from haberdasheries? Do you think they’re something that could be added into a collar after the fact?
I’ve got a few coats that look excellent with the collar popped but are far frustratingly far too floppy to stay popped.
Hi Tony,
I don’t think it is something that could be inserted, no. Sorry. It might be possible for a tailor to put some extra canvas in the collar itself, but it wouldn’t be easy/cheap, and even then the general shape of the collar might mean it doesn’t work.
Sorry, I know it can be frustrating.
I had my fingers crossed, but I thought that might be the case. I guess it falls into the category of ‘if it was easy everyone would be doing it’.
Simon,
Do you know if there will be enough cloth left at Private White on this next run to do MTM? My understanding is that they offer this with some coats for an upcharge. I’d love to order the next one in XS but would need it shortened much more than 4 inches… more like 8, I think.
I can check. Are you sure you want it shortened by that amount though? It would really change the fundamentals of the style. I’d suggest it might be worth looking at other coats if you have to alter by that much
I’ve checked – I’m afraid there will no spare cloth this time for MTM from Private White
How tall is the collar? I suppose that you measure it taking into account the collar band to right?
It depends. It’s good to know both. I’ll check on the measures
The stand is 4.5cm and the collar 6.5cm
I am slim build, 35” chest, 30” waist. I am 5’7”. Will the small size swamp me?
Hi Martyn,
The best way to tell is to compare the measurements on the site to a coat you already own. And remember we do free returns so you can try more than one size.
Having said that, we are sold out of both Small and Extra Small, so you may have to try them from Private White instead of us.
Thanks
Hello Simon,
My chest measure is is ~98 cm (measured under arms, measured at fullest part). However, I’m only ~177 cm / 65 kg. Sort of in between 46/48 for sports jackets.
Would “3/S” be a reasonable guess?
I assume it’s easier to shorten, with a tailor, than to adjust other things.
Hi Alexander,
Yes that would be a reasonable guess, but it’s really a good idea to check the measurements of this against something you already own.
And yes shortening is certainly the easier thing to do.
Hey Simon,
Do you think the sleeves can be opened a bit on this coat?
No, not really Joel
Hi Simon — I was wondering if you might offer two or three suggestions for pairing scarves with this original (gray) version of your donegal coat. I don’t generally wear scarves, so I’m afraid I’m a bit clueless on this front. Are their particular colors that would look right with a gray coat like this?
Thank you, and happy new year.
Hey,
Sure, no worries. I have this dark-grey coat myself, and I think it looks great with: navy, cream, dark brown, gold, purple, other greys, and dark olive too.
I hope that helps
S
Wow really enjoyed this article. I love the idea of a wool over coat. Iv got a filson mackinaw that’s seen better days and iv been thinking of a wool coat/over coat for my next purchase.
I really need something that can go well with jeans, boots and a jumper as well as smart/smart casual. I would appreciate a few suggestions from this community.
If you would consider this type of coat as an overcoat, then I’d go with this. The simple, raglan style makes it very well suited to casual clothing as well as tailoring.
See article here too on the types of overcoats
Hi,
Thank you for the article. It’s a very enjoyable read. The coat looks amazing and is something I have looked for a long time. Especially the charcoal tweed is exceptional and versatile. Sadly it’s seems I am too late and the charcoal is no longer available. Will the be another run?
All the best,
Seamus
Hi Seamus,
Yes there will be another run later in the year. However, it will probably be a slightly different colour – we’ve done a variant every year. It’s worth emailing Suppo[email protected] to be on the waiting list, so you get information as soon it’s available, and first dibs on the coat itself.
Cheers
Simon
I think I’d prefer another run of charcoal, at least I liked that color better than the most recent run (brown). However, heavier cloth (one of the other changes) was definitely for the better.
I should say that I haven’t tried any of them in real life though 🙂 So this is based on my general thinking around these colors and how I’d use such a coat.
Thanks Alexander, all still very useful and welcome
Hi Simon,
I ordered the PS Herringbone coat at last year’s release and mistakenly took a size too large. The correct size was sold out by the time I received it, but I was still glad at least to see firsthand what a fantastically beautiful coat it is. Appreciating the color and material in person was so helpful, but also made consider more carefully how it fit into my wardrobe.
A raglan coat does seem wonderfully versatile, but I wondered too if Donegal wool was the right choice for me. I tend to veer away from country and toward more urban styles, and (like you, recently) have embraced more grays and blacks and a wardrobe of ‘cold’ colors. The texture of Donegal suggests something more country, and though grey (black & cream) in color the cast/temperature struck me as warmer, more yellow than I anticipated.
With the coming pre-order window for all three Donegal wools, I’m looking again at those colors and wondering about their versatility. Charcoal would be my default, but perhaps I’d find that a bit warm-toned as well.
Is that a fair concern as I look to integrate everything? I also love the rich but subdued look of the fabric of your Ettore de Cesare and S. Amal herringbone coats but know that photos can sometimes be misleading. Do you see the Donegal fitting into or at odds with that more city aesthetic? Or rather, am I better off looking for something in a more subdued, less textured fabric, much as I love the cut and style?
To be honest James, I wouldn’t worry about that at all. Both the charcoal and the dark brown are both dark and cold, nothing warm about them. I think they’d both fit very well into that wardrobe
Hello Simon,
I’m curious about this “coming pre-order window for all three Donegal wools”.
Will that be an opportunity to buy the “first edition” version of the donegal coat? If so, what’s the process? (didn’t see anything on the shop page)
Regards,
Alexander
Hi Alexander,
Yes, it will be. All three previous editions will be available, but in the same weight as the mid-grey herringbone.
There is an email with all details that went out to everyone on the waiting list. Perhaps email the support team and ask them to send it to you as well – [email protected]
Hi Simon, proud owner of the Donegal overcoat (ordered this year in the V1 colour, dark grey).
Question for you on alterations:
I tried on both a small and medium and ended up ordering the small (the medium was very wide/loose in the sleeves). Overall the fit is great, but it’s slightly tight in the chest fully buttoned with a sport coat or heavy sweater. You mentioned being able to let out the body by up to 4cm, where would a tailor alter this from? Alternatively, what are your thoughts on moving the buttons by a few cm to loosen it when buttoned up?
*In retrospect, and for other readers, you were right about being ok ordering either the small or medium (ultimately a question of style: relaxed vs slimmer fitting). I think for me though, if I can find an extra few cm in the body of the size 3, it will result in the best overall fit.
Thanks Matthew, and cheers for the feedback.
Moving the buttons can work well, as long as it’s only a little bit, and it might be the easiest solution for you. The adjustments would be taken from the side seams mostly. I can’t remember if there’s much in the back seam, but in any case you’d be best using the side seams to retain balance – only issue there would be it’s only from the armhole down.
Also, be careful altering the body that you keep the same shape of the coat. Take cloth out all the way down, not only in one area
Thank you Simon.
In light of your 15th anniversary of PS, it cannot be overstated (to me at least) the importance of your prompt and sincere replies to reader’s comments in creating an online community, and in building the PS brand.
It has given me confidence to buy from the PS shop without ever having tried things on in person.
I sincerely hope you stick around for another 15 years. I read just about every article you publish, and certainly plan to keep building my wardrobe with “the PS staples” – oxfords, denim shirts, outerwear – making up a large portion of that.
Thank you Matthew, great to know